Legislature(2011 - 2012)

03/14/2011 03:19 PM House L&C


Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

Audio Topic
03:19:37 PM Start
03:19:56 PM HB63
04:47:04 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
           HB 63-FLAME RETARDANTS AND TOXIC CHEMICALS                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:19:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR OLSON announced  that the first order of  business would be                                                               
HOUSE BILL  NO. 63, "An Act  relating to flame retardants  and to                                                               
the manufacture,  sale, and  distribution of  products containing                                                               
flame  retardants; relating  to bioaccumulative  toxic chemicals;                                                               
and providing for an effective date."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:20:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON moved  to  adopt  the proposed  committee                                                               
substitute  (CS)  for  HB 63,  labeled,  27-LS0324\M,  Bannister,                                                               
2/9/11, as the working document.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR OLSON objected for purpose of discussion.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:20:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MIKE COUMBE,  Staff, Representative Lindsey Holmes,  Alaska State                                                               
Legislature,  on  behalf  of the  prime  sponsor,  Representative                                                               
Lindsey Holmes,  presented HB  63.  He  explained that  this bill                                                               
would ban the  use of three toxic chemicals  found in mattresses,                                                               
mattress pads,  upholstered furniture, and the  plastic covers on                                                               
electronics.    This  bill  would  reduce  people's  exposure  to                                                               
dangerous  chemicals in  our homes  and help  limit the  residues                                                               
from persisting in cold climates  such as Alaska.  The chemicals,                                                               
known  as polybrominated  diphenyl ethers  (PBDEs), are  added to                                                               
foam  and   plastic  casings  to  reduce   flammability.    These                                                               
chemicals are easily released from  these products as microscopic                                                               
dust, which can  be ingested, inhaled and absorbed.   They remain                                                               
in the environment  for extended periods of time and  build up in                                                               
fatty tissues,  concentrating as the  chemicals move up  the food                                                               
chain.     Children  are  most   at  risk  since   chemicals  are                                                               
transferred from  mother to child  during pregnancy  and nursing.                                                               
Exposure to  PBDEs can have  permanent effects on children.   The                                                               
PBDEs   are   associated    with   thyroid   disruption,   neural                                                               
developmental impairment,  and other adverse effects  in children                                                               
leading  to  potential  brain malfunctions  and  possible  mental                                                               
retardation.   Despite the fact  that the use of  these chemicals                                                               
is to  reduce fires, firefighters  are also  at high risk  as the                                                               
PBDEs  release   dense  fumes  and   black  smoke   that  reduces                                                               
visibility and a highly corrosive gas known as hydrogen bromide.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. COUMBE related that the  federal government has not been able                                                               
to prohibit  PBDEs since  the 1976  Toxic Substances  Control Act                                                               
has proven inadequate  in protecting the public  and the Congress                                                               
has failed to reform the law.   Bans of PBDEs have been passed in                                                               
12  states including,  Washington,  Oregon,  Michigan, and  Maine                                                               
have prohibited.  Fire safety  would not be compromised with this                                                               
ban  since safer  alternatives exist  and are  in widespread  use                                                               
today.    Companies such  as  Dell,  Hewlett Packard,  IKEA,  and                                                               
Apple, Inc. use  safer alternatives and a  Washington state study                                                               
finds  products  not  containing  PBDEs  are  readily  available.                                                               
Additionally, the  European Union,  Wal-Mart and Sam's  Club have                                                               
also banned the  products.  This bill does  not target retailers,                                                               
but manufacturers must inform retailers of the prohibition.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:25:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. COUMBE provided  a section-by-section analysis of HB  63.  He                                                               
pointed  out  that Section  1  of  the  bill would  prohibit  the                                                               
manufacture,  sale, and  distribution  of  products that  contain                                                               
more than  one tenth of  a percent  of pentaBDE, octaBDE,  or any                                                               
combination of  the two.  It  would also prohibit use  of decaBDE                                                               
in textile  components of mattress pads,  mattresses, upholstered                                                               
furniture or  plastic housing of  electronic products.   It would                                                               
allow  the  Department  of Environmental  Conservation  (DEC)  to                                                               
prohibit  other  flame  retardant  products  if  they  are  found                                                               
harmful to  the public health  or environment and  an alternative                                                               
exists that is  available nationwide so long as  the fire marshal                                                               
determines  the  alternative  satisfies  fire  safety  standards.                                                               
This section  provides exemptions for products  in transportation                                                               
vehicles,  industrial,   products  in  industrial,   mining,  and                                                               
manufacturing.   Additionally, it  exempts products  contained in                                                               
electronic  wiring or  power  transmission  cables, and  products                                                               
sold prior to the effective date.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:26:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. COUMBE related  that the department must  assist retailers in                                                               
identifying  products  that  violate  the law.    It  allows  the                                                               
department  to request  that the  manufacturers of  a product  it                                                               
suspects of being sold in  violation to request the manufacturers                                                               
to certify  the product  as legal or  notify retailers  about the                                                               
existence  of  products  containing   banned  PBDEs.    It  would                                                               
establish penalties  of $1,000 per  violation.  It  also requires                                                               
the Department  of Environmental  Conservation and  Department of                                                               
Health and Social  Services to review flame  retardants and their                                                               
possible alternatives.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:27:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 3:27 to 3:32 p.m.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:32:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. COUMBE related that proposed  Section 1 also allows the state                                                               
to work  with a  regional multi-state  clearinghouse to  help the                                                               
department  carry out  its duties  with respect  to PBDEs  and to                                                               
help coordinate  educational and  outreach activities  related to                                                               
PBDEs.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:33:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. COUMBE stated that proposed  Sections 2 and 3 would authorize                                                               
the department to  begin adopting regulations and  develop a list                                                               
by  February   1,  2014   of  persistent   bioaccumulative  toxic                                                               
chemicals used in products.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:33:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  COUMBE  explained  that  proposed Sections  4  and  6  would                                                               
establish  effective date  for  the  bill.   He  referred to  the                                                               
proposed fiscal  note which  identifies three  new employees:   a                                                               
toxicologist  to  track  chemicals,  a research  analyst,  and  a                                                               
publications specialist to manage the outreach process.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HOLMES  commented   that  although  the  proposed                                                               
committee   substitute  should   not  affect   the  FN,   she  is                                                               
considering some additional changes to  the bill.  In response to                                                               
Representative  Chenault,  she  indicted the  fiscal  note  would                                                               
likely be reduced.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  OLSON  lifted his  objection.  Version  M was  before  the                                                               
committee.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:37:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LAUREN   HEINE,   Environmental   Chemist,   Co-Chair,   Wal-Mart                                                               
Sustainable  Value  Network   for  Chemical  Intensive  Products,                                                               
stated she  also serves  on the  California Green  Ribbon Science                                                               
panel.  She stated that  alternatives to PBDEs are chemicals that                                                               
work  which  means  that  they   have  the  same  fire  retardant                                                               
properties to the PBDEs which  are currently being considered for                                                               
ban.   She  reiterated that  a viable  alternative does  not mean                                                               
fire safety  should be waived  but means the  substitute provides                                                               
the  same  performance  and  cost  without  the  negative  health                                                               
effect.  These  chemicals have been banned by a  number of states                                                               
and the  U.S. manufacturers of  PBDEs have agreed to  stop making                                                               
them.    As   of  2004,  pentaBDE  and  octaBDE   are  no  longer                                                               
manufacturers  in the  state.   In  response to  Chair Olson  she                                                               
agreed they are still imported.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:39:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked for clarification on the terms.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE explained that  three main types of PBDEs, which  are a                                                               
family  of chemicals  with  a common  structure  of a  brominated                                                               
diphenyl ether molecule  which may have anywhere from  one to ten                                                               
bromine  atoms attached,   are  pentaBDE,  octaBDE, and  decaBDE,                                                               
which contain five, eight, and 10 bromine atoms, respectively.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked for clarification on toxicity.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE related  that pentaBDE and octaBDE  are considered more                                                               
persistent,  whereas  decaBDE  breaks  down  from  sunlight  into                                                               
nonaBDE and octaBDE.   She works in the area  of green chemistry,                                                               
which embraces the  idea that risk is the function  of hazard and                                                               
exposure.    Typically,  exposure   is  controlled  but  exposure                                                               
control is expensive since it  requires protective equipment, and                                                               
hazardous waste disposal  plus exposure control can  fail.  Green                                                               
chemists propose that a better  strategy is to use less hazardous                                                               
chemicals initially.   Thus, green  chemists focus on  the hazard                                                               
side  of the  equation  instead of  focusing  on controlling  the                                                               
exposure side.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:41:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEINE  reported  that   the  U.S.  Environmental  Protection                                                               
Administration's  (EPA)  Design for  the  Environment  has had  a                                                               
number of partnership programs that  use the best science and are                                                               
highly  inclusive of  industry and  evaluated 12  alternatives to                                                               
pentaBDE,  which  is  used  in   foam.    The  EPA  is  currently                                                               
evaluating  approximately  27  alternatives   to  decaBDE.    She                                                               
referred members to a list.   She explained that the only way the                                                               
chemical  can   be  considered  is   when  it  is  found   to  be                                                               
economically  and performance  feasible.   She  pointed out  that                                                               
these  chemicals  have  been  brought  forward  by  the  chemical                                                               
manufacturers.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:42:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CHENAULT  asked  for  clarification  on  economic                                                               
equivalent.  He asked for  clarification on the latitude used for                                                               
chemical cost comparisons.   He agreed that everyone  wants to be                                                               
green  but recycled  paper costs  more  than regular  paper.   He                                                               
understood the safety concerns but  he also expressed his concern                                                               
for the additional cost of the green chemicals.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE restated that the  alternatives were brought forward by                                                               
the manufacturers  as viable within  a cost  range.  She  did not                                                               
consider herself  to be  an expert on  chemical costs  but agreed                                                               
that prices vary  between customers depending on the  size of the                                                               
company, the amount  of the chemical, and tend to  drop over time                                                               
as the product  use increases.  She suggested  that the chemicals                                                               
currently being  evaluated were brought forth  by flame retardant                                                               
and product manufacturers who selected  these products since they                                                               
are viable from a cost and performance standard.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:44:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR OLSON asked for clarification on importing PBDEs.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE stated  that the EPA and U.S.  manufacturers reached an                                                               
agreement not to manufacturer PBDEs  any longer.  She offered her                                                               
belief that different mechanisms  apply to prevent importation of                                                               
products manufactured  elsewhere.  She  said that passage  of the                                                               
bill  which  would  affect products  imported  that  contain  the                                                               
PBDEs.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:45:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON  referred  to the  EPA  documentation  in                                                               
members' packets  which states  that the  EPA intends  to support                                                               
and encourage  the voluntary phase  out of manufacturers  by 2010                                                               
and all sales would cease 2013.   He asked for the reason for the                                                               
bill's  necessity if  it will  already be  banned by  the federal                                                               
government.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE asked for his reference.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON   detailed  the  EPA   publication  dated                                                               
2/21/11 EPA document Existing Chemical Action Plan Summary.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEINE  related that  the  EPA  has some  complex  regulatory                                                               
tools,  including   ones  used  for  significant   new  uses  for                                                               
chemicals.  She related her  understanding that the EPA intend to                                                               
support  and encourage  the voluntary  phase out  of manufacturer                                                               
and import of decaBDE.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON referred  to the  reference to  cease all                                                               
sales by 2013.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  offered her belief  that this refers to  the principal                                                               
manufacturers  and importers  of  decaBDE  to initiate  voluntary                                                               
reductions in  the manufacturer and  import.  She  clarified that                                                               
this does not refer to decaBDEs manufactured elsewhere.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HOLMES  clarified  that the  language  refers  to                                                               
manufacturers  agreeing to  stop importing  the chemical  itself,                                                               
not  necessarily importing  products that  contain the  chemical.                                                               
She  explained  that  currently although  chemical  manufacturers                                                               
have stopped manufacturing products in  this country but they can                                                               
still import products that contain chemicals.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:49:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON  recalled  China sold  toys  to  Wal-Mart                                                               
containing lead.   He asked who would be  held responsible, China                                                               
or Wal-Mart.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HOLMES  offered her  belief that  it would  not be                                                               
the individual retailers fault.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   JOHNSON  asked   how  to   prevent  unscrupulous                                                               
manufacturers.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HOLMES asked to consider this further.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   JOHNSON  offered   his  belief   that  chemicals                                                               
outlawed  in  U.S.  will  ultimately   be  shipped  in  by  other                                                               
countries.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:51:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE pointed out that Wal-Mart  has banned PBDEs and will be                                                               
conducting testing.   She thought this would be a  big help since                                                               
Wal-Mart, which  is financially bigger  than most  countries will                                                               
require people  to know what is  in their products.   She thought                                                               
this  is one  of the  most powerful  impacts of  this bill  since                                                               
people  will  have better  information.    Typically, people  are                                                               
unaware  of   the  toxicity.     This  bill  will   help  product                                                               
manufacturers  having more  information of  what they  are making                                                               
and selling.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:52:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER recalled her  qualifications but asked for                                                               
further    clarification   on    her   relationship    with   the                                                               
organizations.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEINE   related  she  hold  a   doctorate  in  environmental                                                               
engineering  chemistry.   She said  she provides  consulting work                                                               
for  nonprofit groups.   She  works with  an organization,  Clean                                                               
Production  Action.    She  works   with  EPA's  Design  for  the                                                               
Environmental and has facilitated  projects for them.  California                                                               
has a  Green Chemistry  initiative and she  was nominated  to the                                                               
Green Ribbon Science Panel, a  national group of scientists.  She                                                               
has been asked to chair  the Wal-Mart Chemical Intensive Products                                                               
(CIP) Tool  Development Committee.   She explained  that Wal-Mart                                                               
has networks for a number  of product classes and groups chemical                                                               
intensive products together.  She  further explained Wal-Mart has                                                               
developed  a tool  with a  company called  The Works  that allows                                                               
them to have better visibility  into the products Wal-Mart sells.                                                               
Wal-Mart  is  attempting  to sell  products  that  contain  safer                                                               
chemicals.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER  reiterated her involvement  with Wal-Mart                                                               
as  Co-Chair of  its Wal-Mart  Chemical Intensive  Products (CIP)                                                               
tool development committee.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:54:10 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEINE  mentioned  that  not  all  alternatives  need  to  be                                                               
chemicals.   A  number of  mattress manufacturers  use inherently                                                               
flame  retardant  fabrics as  a  barrier.    She stated  that  an                                                               
industry  association, the  Phosphorus  Inorganic Nitrogen  Flame                                                               
Retardant  Association  (PINFA),   manufacturers  no  halogenated                                                               
flame  retardants.   This includes  huge corporations  focused on                                                               
non-halogenated  flame  retardants.   In  further  response,  she                                                               
indicated that  means these flame  retardants do not  contain any                                                               
chlorine or bromine.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER   related  his  understanding   that  the                                                               
products would fall under "good" products.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON  related  that the  products  are  "good"                                                               
today.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  pointed out  that it  is good  to engage  and evaluate                                                               
alternatives  since generally  not all  of one  class is  good or                                                               
bad.    She has  co-developed  a  method for  comparing  chemical                                                               
alternatives based on  hazard that grows out of  EPA's Design for                                                               
the  Environment   Program.     This  provides   a  comprehensive                                                               
evaluation  that  allows for  fair  comparison.   She  previously                                                               
compared flame retardant  televisions, including one halogenated,                                                               
and  two halogenated  and  found difference  between  them.   She                                                               
thought the goal was to be fair and evaluate alternatives.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  stated that electronic manufacturers  have found safer                                                               
alternatives, including  Sony, Hewlett Packard, Apple,  Inc. Sony                                                               
Ericcson.  She acknowledged a number  of health issues exist.  As                                                               
people  learn  about  the  chemicals,   they  are  realizing  the                                                               
importance of also  considering the life cycle,  not just whether                                                               
it is safe to  use right now, but whether it is  safe to make and                                                               
use  and dispose  of since  the end  of life  of the  product may                                                               
cause  problems.   She recapped  that the  movement toward  green                                                               
product is a  new and growing market plus  a better understanding                                                               
of impacts that happen along the supply chain.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
3:58:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON  asked whether  she was speaking  for Wal-                                                               
Mart.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE answered that she is not paid by Wal-Mart.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON  responded  that  Wal-Mart  requires  all                                                               
consumer products  to comply with applicable  federal, state, and                                                               
industry  fire regulations.   He  indicated  that California  and                                                               
Hawaii have established  restrictions.  He pointed  out that Wal-                                                               
Mart is doing so to meet state and federal regulators.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  responded that  Wal-Mart wants  PBDEs out  of products                                                               
sold  in  the U.S.  including  infant/toddler,  camera, toys  pet                                                               
toys, skin care products, sporting goods.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON disagreed.   He  suggested that  it meant                                                               
attention to  those products, but  all products must  comply with                                                               
applicable  federal,  state,  and   industry  fire  safety.    He                                                               
summarized that Wal-Mart will comply with existing law.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  added that  Wal-Mart is  so big  it cannot  piece meal                                                               
this so  it is banning  pentaBDE, octaBDE, and decaBDEs  and they                                                               
will test products for quality control.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:00:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MILLER assumed her expertise  is in chemistry.  HE                                                               
asked  how  the  PBDEs  become  toxic  chemicals  once  they  are                                                               
applied.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEINE   responded  that   flame  retardants   are  sometimes                                                               
additives and  are mixed in with  polymers or can be  coated on a                                                               
surface.   Other times  they are  considered reactive,  which she                                                               
said  were less  mobile PBDEs.   She  pointed out  the "new  car"                                                               
smell as  the smell of  the chemicals  leaching into the  air. It                                                               
vaporizes when it gets hot.   The chemicals can migrate depending                                                               
on the environmental pressures.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MILLER  referred  to  the  stability,  that  some                                                               
chemicals are  more stable,  others become  less stable  over the                                                               
life  of the  chemicals or  when heated.   He  asked whether  the                                                               
alternatives are stable.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  said that some  of the alternatives are  inorganic and                                                               
some are  polymers, which  consist of  larger molecules  that are                                                               
less mobile.   The way the EPAs Design for  the Environment (DfE)                                                               
reviews the chemicals  is by considering whether  the chemical is                                                               
persistent, biocumulating, and toxic.   Persistent means it lasts                                                               
a  long time.    Bioaccumulation refers  to  the accumulation  of                                                               
substances, such as pesticides, or  other organic chemicals in an                                                               
organism.  The  chemical can accumulate, such as  if the chemical                                                               
is in  a fish  and humans  eat the fish  the chemical  can become                                                               
more  concentrated.   The persistence  and biocumulating  effects                                                               
are  problematic when  they  are found  to be  toxic  due to  the                                                               
length of the exposure.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:03:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked for the  scope and prevalence of the                                                               
PBDEs  in  furniture  in  Alaska, such  as  mattress  covers  and                                                               
electronic covers.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HEINE explained  that prior  to  phase out  of pentaBDE  and                                                               
octaBDE  were frequently  used in  the  U.S.   The chemicals  are                                                               
found  in breast  milk and  body fluids.   It  takes considerable                                                               
time for the  products to move through the economy.   So unless a                                                               
person is  sleeping in a  brand new bed,  the odds are  the older                                                               
products contain the chemicals.  She  pointed out there will be a                                                               
lag  time in  terms of  the  product distribution  and as  people                                                               
become  aware of  the  PBDEs  and dispose  of  the  product.   In                                                               
response to  Representative Saddler,  she said she  was uncertain                                                               
of PBDEs levels  in Alaska but explained the  PBDEs are contained                                                               
in   textiles,  in   electronics,   wiring  cable,   construction                                                               
materials,  automotive,  aviation,  shipping pallets,  and  water                                                               
borne emulsions and coatings.   She provided the committee a list                                                               
of  alternatives from  the  EPAs DfE.   She  said  she could  not                                                               
provide the  volume of contaminated  products in Alaska  only the                                                               
general products that contain PBDEs.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
4:06:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE THOMPSON  referred to public comments  in members'                                                               
packets  noting significant  opposition  from organizations  that                                                               
oppose  the  preemptive  state  ban  of  these  chemicals.    The                                                               
organizations find  the EPA time  frame is more appropriate.   He                                                               
stated  that  these  organizations   expressed  concern  for  the                                                               
public.   Many  of them  treat  burn patients  and are  concerned                                                               
about  burns  from  products  that are  not  treated  with  flame                                                               
retardants.  He asked for further clarification.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  said she understood  the concern.  She  responded that                                                               
viable alternatives meet fire safety requirements.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  THOMPSON  referred  to the  EPA  completion  date                                                               
timeline of 2013 and asked for the reason to jump out ahead.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  answered that  a number of  other states  have already                                                               
taken  similar action  as  has Wal-Mart.    She highlighted  that                                                               
these chemicals  are banned in Europe,  not necessarily decaBDEs,                                                               
but  the pentaBDE  and octaBDEs  are banned.   She  suggested the                                                               
committee  could  review each  one  separately  if it  felt  that                                                               
delays for some were warranted.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:08:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CHENAULT  related his  understanding that  most of                                                               
these chemicals were  regarded as safe at some  point in history.                                                               
He related  that these  new green chemicals  are coming  on line.                                                               
He  acknowledged  that  the  U.S.   probably  needs  to  regulate                                                               
chemicals but  expressed concern  that setting the  standards too                                                               
high might put  chemical companies out of business.   He inquired                                                               
as to whether  the green replacement chemicals  have had adequate                                                               
testing and  if the alternatives  may be found hazardous  at some                                                               
point in the  future. He further asked about the  PBDEs in breast                                                               
milk.   He  commented  she  is a  researcher  and  asked for  the                                                               
evaluation timeframe of the green chemicals.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE responded that he has  touched on a critical idea.  She                                                               
referred to  the pentaBDE, octaBDE,  and decaBDE PBDEs  which are                                                               
under consideration  in the bill.   She stated that  pentaBDE and                                                               
octaBDE are  pretty much  "out of the  picture" since  action was                                                               
taken in 2004 to ban the  chemicals.  Currently, decaBDE is being                                                               
phased  out.    The  list  of  alternatives  is  currently  being                                                               
evaluated  for  health  and  safety.    She  indicated  that  the                                                               
question on  whether the  alternatives are safe  is one  that the                                                               
EPA  DfE  is  addressing.    The EPA  does  want  to  ensure  the                                                               
chemicals are  safer.  She attested  to the safety aspects  for a                                                               
number of  the alternative chemicals.   She was uncertain  of the                                                               
safety  for some  chemicals and  acknowledged that  some will  be                                                               
deemed unsafe.  She anticipated  that the EPA's DfE process would                                                               
be completed in about six months.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
4:11:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CHENAULT  pointed out that  it has taken  40 years                                                               
to determine decaBDE  is harmful.  He expressed  concern that the                                                               
new chemicals  "green or not"  may have the same  adverse effects                                                               
on humans but it may take 40 years for the toxicity to surface.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR OLSON  asked whether any reduction  in environmental levels                                                               
of PBDEs has  been found since seven years has  lapsed since they                                                               
were banned in 2004.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  answered she  was unsure.   She  offered to  check her                                                               
sources                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  OLSON offered  that subsequent  testifiers  may also  have                                                               
information on this.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  reported that  the U.S.  has had  some of  the highest                                                               
levels in the world.  She  recalled that effects may be available                                                               
from  data  collected in  the  Scandinavian  countries that  have                                                               
banned PBDEs.   She reiterated that the purpose of  the EPA's DfE                                                               
is  to  evaluate  the  safety   across  a  set  of  comprehensive                                                               
attributes.   She related that  in the  past people did  not know                                                               
the  PBDEs were  being  put  into products  and  were not  asking                                                               
questions about persistence and  toxicity.  Additionally, testing                                                               
was  not  required.    She  offered her  belief  that  growth  in                                                               
knowledge,  experience, and  pressure to  use safer  products has                                                               
changed  the dynamic.   Further,  if the  population density  and                                                               
massive use of  these chemicals had not happened  the problem may                                                               
not have arisen, she said.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:14:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON  referred to  the sponsor  statement which                                                               
states  use  of PBDEs  could  cause  health issues  and  lifelong                                                               
health  risks.    He  asked  for  clarification  on  what  health                                                               
problems the  PBDEs cause.   He further  asked for the  effect of                                                               
overexposure to these chemicals.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. HEINE  deferred to  experts for  specific health  impacts but                                                               
related her  understanding that  most of  the health  impacts are                                                               
chronic  ailments.    She reported  some  findings  she  recalled                                                               
including  that the  chemicals affect  the proper  development of                                                               
the  endocrine  and  nervous  system.     She  characterized  the                                                               
problems as more developmental problems.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:15:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PETER  BRIGHAM,   MSW,  Emeritus   Member;  Federation   of  Burn                                                               
Foundations (FBF), stated that he  is an emeritus board member of                                                               
the Federation  of Burn  Foundations.  He  is a  former committee                                                               
chair and member  of the Board of Trustees for  the American Burn                                                               
Association  (ABA).   He  discussed the  issues in  HB  63 as  it                                                               
relates  to the  burn injury  community.   He offered  his belief                                                               
that anyone who  works with burn care providers  and survivors as                                                               
he has  for the past  35 years would  be inclined to  support any                                                               
action that would  save lives or prevent injuries.   He indicated                                                               
he first became  aware of the hazards caused  by the accumulating                                                               
presence of toxic flame retardant  chemicals along with a lack of                                                               
any data  on their  effectiveness.  He  offered that  many within                                                               
the ABA share such concerns  and the association has not endorsed                                                               
the specific  stance of the  industry.   He pointed out  that the                                                               
industry  stance  is  represented  by Citizens  for  Fire  Safety                                                               
(CFS), which  is the industry's  public relations arm.   Contrary                                                               
to the  inference on the  CFS's website, there is  no cooperative                                                               
study  underway by  the  two organizations.    The industry  does                                                               
depend  heavily   on  individual  spokespersons  from   the  burn                                                               
community in the  face of the general concerns in  the health and                                                               
science professions.   He  has tracked the  fire and  burn injury                                                               
statistics as  the ABA member  entrusted with updating  the ABA's                                                               
annual  burn  incidence  fact  sheet.   In  tracking  the  steady                                                               
decline  in fire  and  burn death  or injuries  for  the past  30                                                               
years, he  has noted  many reasons  for the trends.   All  of the                                                               
changes   should  be   taken   into   account  when   considering                                                               
alternative routes to fire safety  and in weighing the hazards of                                                               
PBDEs and other chemicals.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:18:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BRIGHAM responded to an  earlier question.  He explained that                                                               
some  specific tests  of  safety  and under  review  in terms  of                                                               
validity  of  how fires  are  ignited.   These  include  numerous                                                               
safety  efforts, such  as smoke  alarms,  more public  education,                                                               
stronger  building  codes,  and   safer  designs  of  cigarettes,                                                               
cigarette lighters,  and candles.   Unlike  PBDEs, none  of these                                                               
influences  on  fire casualties  have  negative  side effects  of                                                               
PBDEs.  Other changes may have  had a far greater positive impact                                                               
than any that can be claimed  for these chemicals which include a                                                               
major decline  in smoking,  the transition  in home  cooking from                                                               
the stove  to the  microwave and the  U.S.'s growing  reliance on                                                               
restaurants  and  fast  food  outlets.   Given  all  these  other                                                               
reasons  for the  decline  on  in fire  and  burn casualties  the                                                               
balance of the  concern needs to shift  toward increased scrutiny                                                               
and action  related to the  accelerating presence of  toxic flame                                                               
retardant chemicals.  He urged members to support HB 63.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:20:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked whether  he represented the American                                                               
Burn Association (ABA).                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BRIGHAM answered  that  the  ABA does  not  have a  specific                                                               
position on  polybrominated fire retardants in  consumer products                                                               
since the  organization has a  widely diverse opinion  within the                                                               
association as to the dangers.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON referred  to another  letter in  members'                                                               
packets from David  M. Heimbach, MD, FACS, who  is Past President                                                               
of the  ABA and Past  President of the International  Society for                                                               
Burn Injury (ISBI) who opposes this  bill and purports to let the                                                               
EPA phase out the retardant.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BRIGHAM agreed that the views  are diverse among the ABA.  He                                                               
acknowledged that Dr.  Heimbach is a distinguished  member of the                                                               
organizations.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:21:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ARLENE  BLOOM,  Scholar,   University  of  California,  Berkeley;                                                               
Executive Director, Green Science  Policy Institute, related that                                                               
she  studies   organic  chemicals.     Carbon   bromine  chlorine                                                               
represents  the kinds  of molecules  that  stay in  the body  for                                                               
months or  years.   She stated  that she  and her  colleagues who                                                               
study these  chemicals have become  concerned when  the chemicals                                                               
are used  in consumer products  since they  tend to be  stored in                                                               
fat, which is  one reason PBDEs are found in  breast milk.  These                                                               
are not  naturally occurring  chemicals in the  body so  the body                                                               
does  not have  the  ability  to expel  the  toxins.   These  are                                                               
persistent chemicals that will stay in  the body for a long time.                                                               
She offered that  human health data is available on  PBDEs in the                                                               
home.   She  related that  asbestos is  an occupational  chemical                                                               
that causes mesothelioma cancer in  those who work with asbestos.                                                               
She reported  that children exposed to  PBDEs suffer intelligence                                                               
issues similar to  those found in children exposed to  lead.  The                                                               
PBDEs harm fertility.   She stated that  significant research has                                                               
been done on animals.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. BLOOM explained  that the reason many of  the flame retardant                                                               
chemicals  are in  our  homes is  due  to California's  furniture                                                               
flammability standards  and its distribution of  furniture on the                                                               
west  coast.   Chances are  if the  furniture label  indicates it                                                               
meets   the   California   standard,  it   may   contain   PBDEs,                                                               
particularly if the  furniture was purchased prior to  2004.  She                                                               
offered  her  belief   that  it  is  important   to  protect  the                                                               
population  from  these types  of  chemicals.    She said  it  is                                                               
difficult to  know the impact  but she thought  it may be  a huge                                                               
boon to human health.  She  pointed out studies with animals have                                                               
shown an increase in  neurological impairment, hyperactivity, and                                                               
certain  types  of  cancer  can  be  caused  by  these  types  of                                                               
chemicals.    She  indicated  an   increase  in  those  types  of                                                               
behaviors has  been found in  children.  She asked  whether these                                                               
chemicals should be  allowed to impact our children.   She agreed                                                               
that  it is  important to  ensure that  the replacements  are not                                                               
problematic.     She  offered  her  belief   that  decabrominated                                                               
diphenyl ether  (decaBDE) is  being replaced  with decabrominated                                                               
diphenylethylene which  is only two  atoms apart, has  been found                                                               
to be  similarly persistent  and biocumulative.   She  thought it                                                               
may also be toxic.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:28:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR OLSON banned related that  pentaBDE and octaBDE were banned                                                               
in 2004.   He asked whether any noticeable reductions  in the use                                                               
of pentaBDE and octaBDE have occurred.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. BLOOM answered that pentaBDE  was used in California from the                                                               
80s until 2004.  She reported  that furniture has an average life                                                               
span  of three  owners or  30 years.   She  also stated  that the                                                               
chemical leach out  when the furniture is taken  to the landfill.                                                               
However, most  of the pentaBDE  furniture is still in  our homes.                                                               
She  stressed   the  importance  of  identifying   the  furniture                                                               
containing pentaBDE so it could  be safely disposed and not leach                                                               
into our  water, soils, and  food supply.   In response  to Chair                                                               
Olson, she  mentioned that  she had a  sample of  furniture taken                                                               
from Alaska's  Capitol Building and  tests showed it  did contain                                                               
pentaBDE.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CHENAULT commented  that mesothelioma  associated                                                               
with asbestos,  which was used  in houses  for years.   He stated                                                               
the asbestos  was replaced  with a man-made  fiber.   He surmised                                                               
that it  is likely  that insulation  is probably  just as  bad as                                                               
asbestos  insulation.   He  remarked that  this  is just  another                                                               
example of replacing a chemical with another chemical.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
4:31:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DAVID  HEIMBACH, Director,  University of  Washington (UW),  Burn                                                               
Center,  state  that for  the  past  35  years  he has  been  the                                                               
director of  the UW's Burn  Center.  He  pointed out that  he has                                                               
taken  care of  all the  severely burned  people from  Alaska, or                                                               
about 30  per year.  He  offered his belief that  fire retardants                                                               
save lives.   They provide minutes extra to get  out of a burning                                                               
room  or home  and protect  them.   Children are  most likely  to                                                               
suffer  from   burns  when  mattresses,  pillow,   sleepwear,  or                                                               
furniture do  not contain fire  retardants.  He remarked  that he                                                               
has  listened  to today's  testimony.    He recalled  one  person                                                               
testified that when  PBDEs products burn it  produces dense black                                                               
smoke.   He related that  pure pine  wood burns and  releases 250                                                               
toxic  chemicals that  are far  more  toxic than  the ones  under                                                               
discussion and plastics probably  contain 500-600 toxic chemicals                                                               
when  they burn.    He said  that dense  black  smoke is  trivial                                                               
compared  to  smoke  from  burning   many  other  products.    He                                                               
emphasized that  it is  not true that  many safer  retardants are                                                               
available.   It took 40 years  to figure out that  decaBDE causes                                                               
bad  things to  happen, mostly  in large  doses in  animals.   He                                                               
related his  understanding that a  definitive study has  not been                                                               
performed that  identifies harm  caused to  humans.   He remarked                                                               
that relating PBDEs to lower  intelligence is somewhat similar to                                                               
the  arguments   for  asbestos  removal.     Once   asbestos  was                                                               
determined to be dangers people rushed  to remove it only to find                                                               
it is far more dangerous to  the people removing it than it would                                                               
have been to leave it alone.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DR. HEIMBACH said he became  interested into PBDEs when the State                                                               
of Washington passed  its laws without ever asking  anyone in the                                                               
burn community  for their  views.   He was not  aware of  the law                                                               
until it had  already passed.  He appreciated  the testimony that                                                               
highlights no  one knows whether  the replacements will  be safer                                                               
since it  took 40 years to  discover toxicity with decaBDEs.   He                                                               
related a  recent scenario in which  a 9-month-old baby was  in a                                                               
crib, laying  on fire  retardant pillow  on a  non-fire retardant                                                               
mattress.   A  candle  fell into  crib and  the  little baby  was                                                               
charred up  to her  mid-chest to  the point  where her  chest was                                                               
laying  on the  pillow.   He  observed that  the  pillow was  not                                                               
burned at all.   He offered his opinion that this  is as clear an                                                               
example as he  could provide to demonstrate  what fire retardants                                                               
can do.   He felt  certain more will be  injured and die  from no                                                               
fire  retardant  in  products  than  ever  will  be  from  people                                                               
thinking they've  inhaled PBDEs toxic  chemicals.  He  has served                                                               
as the President of  the ABA and the ISBI.  He  spent 12 years on                                                               
the Medical Advisory Board for  the Shriners Burns Hospitals.  He                                                               
concluded  that he  had  the unique  experience  of receiving  an                                                               
award  from  the  Dalai  Lama  for  his  work  in  burn  care  in                                                               
developing countries.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:36:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
GORDON  NELSON,  Ph.D.,  Vice  President,  Florida  Institute  of                                                               
Technology, speaking on  behalf of himself, stated that  he has a                                                               
doctorate in Organic Chemistry from  Yale University.  He related                                                               
he first started  working with flame retardants  in plastics when                                                               
he was  at the General Electric  Company in the early  1970s.  He                                                               
reported  that   decaBDE  has  been   used  in   televisions  and                                                               
appliances  since  1975.   In  1974,  the U.S.  Consumer  Product                                                               
Safety  Commission found  televisions were  of unreasonable  risk                                                               
due to  fire hazards.  At  the time approximately 200  deaths per                                                               
year  were   attributable  to  fire.     When   the  Underwriters                                                               
Laboratories,  Inc.  (UL)  adopted voluntary  regulations,  which                                                               
became effective  in 1975, the deaths  were reduced to zero.   He                                                               
reported  that  each  person  has a  40  percent  probability  of                                                               
experiencing  a fire  in his/her  lifetime  or to  have the  fire                                                               
department come  to our home.   He reported that  televisions and                                                               
plastics  made without  a  flame retardant  will  create a  life-                                                               
threatening fire.   He said he  has seen these fires  happen.  He                                                               
emphasized that  octaBDE and pentaBDE have  not been manufactured                                                               
in  the  U.S. since  January  2005  and  were only  small  volume                                                               
chemicals.   DecaBDE is manufactured  in large quantities  and is                                                               
the main fire retardant chemical  used for a variety of products,                                                               
including  televisions and  backing  for carpet.    He said  that                                                               
decaBDE  does  not  have  the  same  properties  as  pentaBDE  or                                                               
octaBDE.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:39:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DR.  NELSON  reported that  the  European  Union has  extensively                                                               
tested decaBDE by the risk  assessment process and has been found                                                               
to  be of  reasonable  risk.   Thus,  decaBDE  is  not banned  in                                                               
Europe.  He related  that decaBDE has and is to  be phased out by                                                               
December 2012.   He stated that it is not  only the manufacturers                                                               
that have made  the commitment but also  ICL Industrial Products,                                                               
which is the  largest U.S. importer of decaBDE.   Thus, it is not                                                               
just the  manufacturers who  have agreed to  the phase  out since                                                               
importers have  banned decaBDE as  well, except for  the military                                                               
and transportation  uses scheduled to  be phased out  by December                                                               
31, 2013.   He related  that often a  one for one  replacement is                                                               
not possible  and may need a  new flame retardant or  plastic for                                                               
an application.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:41:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DR.  NELSON recalled  recalled  earlier  testimony on  Wal-Mart's                                                               
testing and on  the fiscal note.  He stated  that Direct Analysis                                                               
in Real Time  (DART) High Resolution Mass  Spectrometry can offer                                                               
immediate results, noting  that waving a piece of  plastic by the                                                               
instrument  would identify  the  flame retardant.   However,  the                                                               
equipment costs $210,000  and takes a scientist to operate.    He                                                               
remarked  that  he  was  please to  see  the  proposed  committee                                                               
substitute (CS) has an effective date  of 2013 given that the EPA                                                               
has  a consensus  process underway  and major  manufacturers have                                                               
agreed to  phase out the project.   This would allow  that timing                                                               
to occur.   He related that a  similar bill is in  the other body                                                               
and he  prefers some  of the  language.  He  referred to  page 2,                                                               
lines 5-6 of HB 63 which refers  to a flame retardant that is not                                                               
a brominated flame retardant.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
4:42:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DR.  NELSON also  referred  to  page 4  of  HB  63 which  defines                                                               
"brominated flame  retardant" as a flame  retardant that contains                                                               
pentaBDE, octaBDE, and  decaBDE.  He indicated that  as a chemist                                                               
a brominated  flame retardant  is any  chemical product  used for                                                               
flame retardant  purposes that contains  the element  of bromine.                                                               
He offered  his belief  that the  language in  the bill  would be                                                               
confusing  to scientists.    He preferred  some  language in  the                                                               
Senate version  of the  bill that  removes the  proposed sections                                                               
"review  by departments"  and  "list of  toxic  chemicals."   The                                                               
Senate  version  would  also  insert a  simpler  provision  of  a                                                               
multistate chemicals clearinghouse.   He encouraged the committee                                                               
to consider requiring the clearinghouse  to work with the EPA and                                                               
European agencies  as well.   He summarized  that he  agreed with                                                               
comments  asking whether  the bill  would accomplish  anything as                                                               
written given that  the EPA has a planned phase  out.  He offered                                                               
his belief that it does not accomplish much.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:44:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DR. NELSON said,  "If decaBDE were a hazard, which  it's not, the                                                               
legislation doesn't provide  for take back.   It doesn't prohibit                                                               
placement  of used  products  in landfills.    It doesn't  remove                                                               
products."   These products will be  around for 30 years  and the                                                               
exposure will not  change.  If a hazard exists,  much more should                                                               
be  done.   He urged  Alaska to  allow EPA  to do  its work.   He                                                               
suggested Alaska establish  an intergovernmental clearinghouse to                                                               
review  these materials  and other  materials since  it would  be                                                               
useful not only  for Alaska and other states.   He concluded that                                                               
the agreement with EPA sets  forth a rational transition to newer                                                               
alternatives which is critical in these circumstances.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
[HB 63 was held over.]                                                                                                          

Document Name Date/Time Subjects